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• • May 30, 2012 at 8:08 am #62306
    erickp

    Member

    Not sure if this question was posed before but I'd like everyone's input. I know for the most part you can set up the page numbering for a catalog, book, etc., any wany way you'd like and ID allows for this flexibility, BUT is there a best practices as to when to actually start the numbering? Should “page 1” start on the first page of actual content within the publication or should “page 1” be the cover and continue from there, regardless if you see the number or not. Would like everyone's view on this topic. Thanks!

    ~Erick

  • May 30, 2012 at 2:42 pm #62307
    Alan Gilbertson

    Participant

    For books in English, the conventions are well established. You can find lots of detail (possibly more than you ever want to know) in The Chicago Manual of Style under the general heading of book sections, and if you're designing for print you should have a copy on your bookshelf for reference. As far as numbering is concerned, lowercase Roman numerals start at i on the half title page and continue through the whole of the front matter (copyright page, TOC, preface, introduction, etc.). Content numbering begins at 1 on the first page of chapter 1 or, where it applies, the section opener (“Part One: My Adventures in Siberia”) or second half title page.

    Odd numbers are always right-hand (recto) pages, and chapters always start on a recto unless they are specified as a two page spread, in which case page 1 would be a second half title or a section opener on the recto before the first chapter.

    For magazines, the first recto after the cover is usually page 1; newspapers, the front page is page 1; other publications, “it depends.” Academic publications and professional journals usually have very specific style guides that you would follow. For a catalog, you can pretty much roll your own page numbering, provided it's visible and makes sense to the reader.

  • May 30, 2012 at 5:40 pm #62310
    Amy Gilbert

    Participant

    That sounds like the convention for non-fiction. Fiction is different and not as cut and dry. Usually, the first page of chapter one is not 1 and is probably some number based on some or all the unnumbered front matter pages.

  • May 31, 2012 at 2:33 pm #62328
    Alan Gilbertson

    Participant

    Interesting. I've not seen or designed a fiction work that doesn't follow Chicago. Other than the occasional publication that puts an introduction on page 1 (some anthologies of short stories do that), I don't recall a book that began content numbering in the front matter. Specific publishers may have a house style that requires that, of course, but you'd know that from their style guide before starting the project.

  • June 8, 2012 at 9:51 am #62370
    Mr.Screens

    Member

    In 30 years of laying out publications, my experience with numbering conventions corresponds with what Alan describes. For catalogues and brochures, you may get a clue from the printing specs. For example, if the job is described as “28pp self-cover,” make page 1 the outside front cover. If it's “24pp plus cover,” start numbering on the first recto after the OFC.

  • June 8, 2012 at 10:18 am #62371
    Sheri G

    Member

    I'm with Amy on this one. I've been publishing fiction for seven years now at two houses, and we do not number ANY of the pages before the first page Chapter 1. It doesn't matter if there's some sort of “title” page or “section” page (i.e. Part 1), Page 1 is always on the right hand side of the book, on the first page of Chapter 1.

    All the “pre-chapter 1” pages (title page, copyright page, dedication, TOC, etc.) have no numbers whatsoever.

    Again, I think it comes down to the Publisher style guides, as Alan pointed out.

  • December 2, 2018 at 9:24 am #111924
    Juanita Baker

    Member

    Alan Gilbertson that is the most succinct and clear explanation I’ve read. Thank you.
    There is usually good reasons for following traditions.
    But must we follow tradition?
    To me roman numerals are confusing. And if you want to tell somone to read page xii that is meaningful as it might be something that the author did not write and did not expect you to start reading there. And I suppose most authors want you to skip the beginning or know you will anyway.

    Shouldn’t page numbers start where you want the reader to start reading?
    Why follow a tradition that is confusing?
    Why not just start page numbers with the first creative page where you give a message to readers to involve them in the book?
    That’s where you would want them to start reading, to get in the mood to read the book, to start appreciating what you want them to remember.

  • December 2, 2018 at 7:16 pm #111925
    Tom Pardy

    Member

    It is not necessary that the roman numerals actually be shown on the pages to which they apply (ie., front matter). But, unless you assign *some sort* of page number to those introductory pages, InDesign will not play ball. When you wish to assign page numbering to those pages, InDesign offers you a choice of seven different formats (at least in CS6, which is what I am using.)

    You need to specify those pages by number if you wish to print them. Giving them roman numerals (or one of the other five possibilities, assuming you have used 1…2…3 for the main pages) allows you to print, for example, the Table of Contents so that you can check it against the main pages.

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