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• • November 17, 2015 at 9:16 am #79480
    RWVVV

    Member

    I could use some guidance. I usually do this a bit on the fly, estimating the positioning, but I want a better solution. Let’s start with this piece of knowledge: Im still on CS5.5!

    So for instance you have a text like this:

    ——–

    Heading

    Subheading

    Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. Curabitur id neque ante. Nam sagittis consectetur nisi. Aliquam ut lacus eget massa malesuada luctus a in dolor. Donec sit amet interdum purus. Donec non eleifend nibh, eget lacinia ligula. Donec ultrices augue non tempor ornare. Proin hendrerit nisl vel metus fringilla elementum. Nunc euismod mi quis diam tincidunt, sed consequat mauris pharetra.

    ———

    Let’s say on a single A4 page I would have a heading maybe two subheadings and some para’s in between. Now I want to spice up the appearance of the subheading by putting a graphic behind it, be it some kind of box with a gradient in it, whatever…Normally I would just create something in ID or paste something from AI, put it behind the text frame and manualy position it.

    How would I go about a better way of doing this, aligning my graphic perfectly to the subheading? I don’t want to put the subheadings in separate text frames or use the baseline grid ;)

    Your help would be much appreciated.

  • November 17, 2015 at 7:06 pm #79486
    Frances Simons

    Member

    Hi RWVVV

    I would use paragraph styles to do this. I do not like a cluttered layout and use as few frames as possible (I never use separate text frames for this kind of work).

    Perhaps others have a better idea but styles are so easy and clean under the hood. And if anyone sees your native file, they know you know what you are doing ;-)

  • November 18, 2015 at 2:34 am #79491
    RWVVV

    Member

    Hi Effleess,

    What you are saying doesn’t make sense to me; you can’t insert images as a para style to my knowledge, at least not with CS5.5.

    I can’t share my source file, because it’s under embargo, but here’s a id file that helps:

    https://raymonvanvught.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/id_graphics_in_heading.indd_.zip

    If you look at the file you see text like in my first message, the subheadings now have pasted green illustrator graphics behind them, I put them there manually. What I want to achieve is that I can apply the green boxes as a nicely aligned’style’ to the line of text, as a sort of anchored object that moves along when edits are made to the text.

    I’m not even sure if this is even possible. Another option would be to get text to fit the baseline grid, because this would enable better alignment, though I think the baseline grid limits me in how I use fonts.

  • November 18, 2015 at 5:15 am #79493
    Allen Cobb

    Member

    Hi RWVVV,

    I don’t have access to 5.5 anymore, but here’s an IDML file that should import successfully. I’m pretty certain there are no newer features in what I did in this example:

    https://acobb.com/temp/id_graphics_in_heading.idml

    You’ll see that although there’s no way I know of to embed an image within a para style, you can still do some pretty creative things with the paragraph rules (above & below). It would be a very cool new feature if ID were to add a “use image” option for a paragraph rule… Or even to provide more basic options like your beveled right edge effect, gradients, etc.

    The basic approach is to set up a rule “above” that serves as the main background color. You can make it so thick that it completely covers the text, except that it is BEHIND the text. This permits reversed-out text on a dark color background, text with an overbar, or even hidden text with a rule that covers it in the virtual color “paper” (useful for hiding a running head on a title page).

    You can also extend rules beyond the text frame (or force them to stay inside), and make them either frame-width or text-width — so there’s your exact positioning requirement.

    There are many limitations, but considering these things were originally just “rules,” it’s amazing what can be done. The color assignments can even be tints, and since the Below rule overprints the Above rule, you can have a background color with another color as a border, offset, accent, etc. I created two quickie headings with your green and then tried to use most of the rule features.

    Hope this helps. Maybe put in a feature request for “images as paragraph rules.”

    Allen

  • November 18, 2015 at 5:48 am #79494
    RWVVV

    Member

    Hey Allen,

    Thanks a lot for this. While it isn’t precisely what I was looking for, a very useful thing to know nonetheless. :)

  • November 18, 2015 at 9:33 am #79501
    Allen Cobb

    Member

    RWVVV,

    You’re welcome! I realize it’s just an isolated technique (though one with wide-ranging application), but in some situations it might suffice.

    For something perhaps closer to what I think you’re seeking, I would probably create a graphic frame containing the background image, and an object style to go with it, and then just anchor it to the beginning of the heading. But this is still mostly a manual operation, and I’m not sure it’s any better (or different) from what you’re already doing.

    Would the addition of a new “Paragraph Rule” feature that supports an embedded graphic being “contained” by a rule completely fulfill your need? It’s a cool idea for a lot of text decoration uses.

    I’ve always wished for some expansion of Paragraph Styles — particularly one that supports run-in headings. It’s surprising that ID still can’t do that. (It can fake a run-in heading with embedded styles, but those aren’t separate paragraphs as all other real headings are, so you can’t change a run-in “heading” into a real heading by just switching to a different paragraph style.)

    Allen

    • November 18, 2015 at 10:38 am #79504
      RWVVV

      Member

      Normally I would just place or paste a graphic from AI, or build it in ID and just manually align it to the bottom of the heading, then move using position controls or just nudging it with arrow keys. Then memorise how I did it for the next instances…haha. A pain though, when the text gets edited. But that is why I add in these things at the last stage.

      What you write about a new Para Rule feature, that would be very nice indeed, especially if it would scale the background image when you change the font size used in your para style.

  • November 23, 2015 at 10:03 am #79580
    Kelly Vaughn

    Participant

    I would use IndyFont Pro to make a font containing a single character (that wide bar that you want to use for the background). Then use that character as a bullet in a paragraph style. All you need to do to add the wide-bar-bullet is to specify that paragraph style, with some sort of white space. To get the subheading to sit directly on top of the wide bar bullets, you can either really tighten up the leading in the SubHeading paragraph style, or you can adjust the wide bar character in your font design to have it sit really low on the baseline.

    You may even be able to apply the wide bar bullet to the actual subheading paragraph style itself, although that will take some more fiddling.

  • November 23, 2015 at 11:12 am #79590
    RWVVV

    Member

    Wow, that’s a pretty cool idea!

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