Color me annoyed this morning. It’s not the weather. After all, it’s a typical beautiful day here on the outskirts of Seattle — oppressive near-rain gray, just the way I like it. No, once again my frustration turns to InDesign. As you all know, I love InDesign, but love is like a magnet: It can repulse as quickly as it attracts. So forgive me a short IDSGOM, which may be educational to some readers.
The issue, you see, is the Adobe Illustrator format. Now, I was a Freehand man, myself. I loved Freehand dearly in the early ’90s. I even wrote a plug-in for Freehand 3.0 which (much) later evolved into an InDesign plug-in. But like many of us, I switched to Illustrator somewhere in the mid-90s. I can certainly understand why Adobe InDesign hasn’t historically opened Freehand files. But Illustrator… Illustrator is the grandpappy of Adobe’s happy family. Of course, InDesign can import Illustrator files. In fact, Adobe has spent countless marketing dollars telling the world that InDesign can open native Illustrator files.
But it’s not true.
InDesign cannot read the AI file format. It’s all been a sham. I can’t believe I fell for it, and I’m not sure if I’m more angry at Adobe for not allowing me to import AI files or at myself for having drunk the KoolAid and believed them without digging deeper.
But David, I hear you shouting, I import .AI files all the time! Yes, but InDesign isn’t reading the AI part… The only reason InDesign can import that file properly is that you have saved it with the Create PDF Compatible File checkbox turned on. InDesign is reading the PDF part, not the AI part! If you turn off that checkbox, the resulting file is much smaller, and while you can technically import it into InDesign, you won’t get a preview or be able to print or export it properly.
Our friend Mordy Golding wrote up a wonderful explanation of this on his Illustrator blog, but he appears to come to the conclusion that this is perfectly reasonable. If you want to import an Illustrator file, save as AI with Creative PDF Compatible File turned on; or save as PDF and turn on the Preserve Illustrator Editing Capabilities checkbox. Either way, you get a bigger-than-necessary file because you get an AI file plus a PDF (or a PDF plus an AI), all in one. Mordy, come to your senses!
Come on, Adobe: Either create a true AI file import filter that doesn’t rely on PDF or stop telling us that we can bring AI files into InDesign. I’d much prefer the former, of course. If this is a creative Suite, the apps should all talk the same language.
Along with importing native AI files sans PDF, I’d like:
- Turn on and off layers in layered TIFF files
- Turn on and off layers in AI files (with or without the PDF compatible file checkbox on)
- Import spot colors and vector info in TIFF files
- Be able to copy and paste from InDesign into Photoshop and have it act the same way as copying from Illustrator into Photoshop
- Copy and paste chunks of text from one Suite application to another, maintaining formatting (at least maintaining as much formatting as could reasonably expected — I don’t expect all apps to have all the same formatting controls as some)
- Ability to import JPEG2000 images. This is a far superior to the plain jane JPG format, and Acrobat has supported it for years. (You can export JPEG 2000 files from InDesign inside a PDF, but not import JPEG2000 files.)
- Export PSD files with layers. Or export PDF files with layers that Illustrator and Photoshop can open (with layers).
Okay, I’d better stop here before I blow a gasket. Time to hear what y’all think. Any other file format faux pas that need fixing?
This article was last modified on December 18, 2021
This article was first published on January 22, 2007
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This morning I created press-quality PDFs using the latest version of InDesign CC 2015.4 and all the placed .ai logos are jagged!
my complain about the native format of Illustrator when imported in Indesign is that their is no way to place it and set a bleed value either on import or inside illustrator itself. A real pain… it is to reopen it and enlarge the artboard to allow bleed area…
Lisa I haven’t found that at all. Strange! I don’t remember the last time I saved something as an EPS from AI. Maybe 8 or 10 years ago.
Which versions of the software are you using?
CC InDesign v11, CC Illustrator v19
I find that .AI files saved with the PDF option checked still do not import or print properly from InDesign. The only solution I have is to save as .EPS format which wasn’t necessary before. Very disappointed with InDesign.
Lisa: As I said in the article above, you can really only use .AI files when the PDF option is turned on. There should be no reason to save as EPS! I explain this in detail in my Lynda.com title InDesign Insider Training: Working with Photoshop and Illustrator.
There must be something wrong with your system or export or workflow or something. What happens when you try to import the PDF into InDesign?
thanks David, your final trip did the trick. All is well in my world again.
Ah, you’re talking about the white background! You can get a transparent background by enabling “Transparent Background” in the Import Options dialog box when placing. (You only need to do this once, as that setting is sticky and will apply to future pdfs you import.) See: https://creativepro.com/understanding-indesigns-place-pdf-options.php
I’ve tried it 3x, but no luck. AI vector logo saved with pdf option looks like flattened file with white bkgnd. when placed in InDesign, even when previewing high quality display on iMac retina screen. And it does not improve when exporting as PDF from InDesign… Acrobat shows white bkgnd. around AI logo. Sadly, although saving as EPS is very annoying – it imports, exports & prints properly.
So, can you clarify this comment from one of the chat boards: “The two things that concern me about bringing in large amounts of vector data are (a) loss of Illustrator-specific features that InDesign doesn’t support, and (b) manageability of that vector data within InDesign. I love that I can bring a vector shape from Illustrator into my layouts via copy-and-paste, and then change the transparency, stroke, fill, etc. without having to make multiple external versions. However, InDesign handles vectors in a more clunky way than Illustrator, so complex vector work becomes harder to manage, not easier…at least in my experience.”
Kara: That person is talking about copying and pasting from Illustrator to InDesign. I would never recommend doing that for anything other than very simple graphics. Using File > Place is far more reliable. But of course, once placed you cannot edit the paths in InDesign. You’d have to go back to AI to do that.
Ok, thanks! I guess I’m over my fear of linking to Illustrator files. And I’m guessing you would recommend linking directly to PSD files too, even if they are complex, large files with many layers?
Is this still the case? I’m trying to decide whether to link my Indesign file to incredibly large Illustrators files (large maps with a ton of information) or generate EPS, TIFF, or JPEGs, which I then link. This is for large documents that will both be printed and loaded as PDFs onto the web. I am concerned about the size of my Indesign file. Thanks!
Kara: Generally the size of the AI file does not change the size of the INDD file (unless you embed it, which you rarely need to do). Remember that exporting TIFF or JPEG will rasterize the artwork (turn it into pixels). Importing the PDF or AI file is probably the right way to go.
Ten years after its demise, Freehand remains better software than InDesign and Illustrator combined. Once it acquired Macromedia, Adobe had a fiduciary responsibility to continue supporting Freehand for the sake of users. Adobe instead opted to market two subpar programs, rather than invest in one excellent one. This disregard for its customers is telling, and should serve as a warning to anyone who relies on Illustrator or Photoshop to make a living.
@Saetwa: InDesign has Directional and Gradient Feather in the Effects panel, which can sort of do these things.
make it possible to have transparency from a diagonal point of view and from different sides like you can in corel draw
Does this mean that when InDesign sends an .ai file to print, it is really just sending the PDF part of the file to print? If that is true, I had better start taking more notice of what the PDF settings are in my .ai files.
Something needs to be done about this. PDF has just become a bog standard because it works. Now it is starting to suck, not because pdf sucks, but because acrobat sucks. All of these features and more holes and problems.
We need something like svg that can handle the inclusion of everything else (video, audio, etc).
Nextstep has postscript as its display language and it worked really well. OS X really takes the best of the pdf stuff. I mean, print straight to a pdf from anything at any time. Now that is slick.
Now if acrobat could get back to fitting on a floppy!
More info on Illustrator vs. PDF (editing PDFs in Illustrator, details on how an .ai file is a .pdf and how it’s not) are in this interesting post by Leonard Rosenthol on the Acrobat User blog.
A, it’s hard to know. Do you have View > Display Quality > High enabled? That’s the only way to really ensure that you’re seeing what’s really in the PDF.
Note that I’ve heard a number of complaints about what people see in PDFs in Acrobat, and the solution is often to turn off some of the anti-aliasing features in Acrobat’s Preferences dialog box. Acrobat is constantly trying to make stuff look better, but sometimes it ends up fooling you with artifacts that don’t really exist in the PDF.
I’d like to know WHY it is that everytime I import an AI file into ID, that contains, for instance, .25 or smaller faint grey lines (outlines/boxes, etc), they appear perfectly in the application, but appear black or slightly thicker as a pdf? Is there something I’m missing? I’ve toyed around with this now for hours. The pdf isn’t supposed to be printed, just viewed from another computer! Can somebody PLEASE help me?!!!
Blending modes in InDesign, a dream? Maybe that is coming in CS3 but I have my doubts. If we had cross platform consistency we’d be using Microsoft, right? Tim Macking MCSE
Since we’re on the topic of cross-applications consistency, I thought you might find this post interesting:
https://rwillustrator.blogspot.com/2007/01/c-vs-cvc-battle-of-pantone-proportions.html
“Any other file format faux pas that need fixing?”
I would offer two, though one of them is not really a file format issue:
1. It would really be great if InDesign supported Photoshop’s blening modes, not just alpha transparency.
2. It would also be very nice if the text engines in all the applications were sufficiently the same to allow copying and pasting editable text objects between them.
Ah, okay. Like synchonising the schortcuts for illu and indi for example.
It’s called a suite for a reason, there should absolutely be more “exchange” features between ID and PS/AI (and vice verse). I can understand why a few of these suggestions might not be feasible, but some seem easy enough to implement, such as the copy/paste and import/export features David mentions.
For example. Create a massive multiple layer Illustrator file. Layers, sub-layers, get crazy. Export as a PSD with “create layers” selected (be brave and select both of the editability options). Open the resulting file in Photoshop. Layers, sub-layers, even text layers (gasp, formatted live text!) have come through, almost perfectly translated. That is true application interchange. Nobody’s asking for full round-tripping file exchange, but for more options getting files from one place to the next.
The Illustrator engineers and the InDesign engineers should really go out for tequila shots. I’d buy!
WOZ, What i meant was, that switching the applications will be transparent to us, users.
Bryan, The Creative Suite Conference in Miami next month will have several new sessions, including one that focuses on what we know about CS3 (especially Photoshop CS3, of course).
We’ll also be doing a CS3 conference in the fall, back in Chicago, I think. And, of course The InDesign Conference will be in New York in early June… if Adobe hasn’t released CS3 by then, I’ll have to eat my hat.
btw, Atoz; I ?really? hope the CS will not turn in to a ‘one app can do it all, pixel or vector or layout’. Every specialty requires it’s own app. I don’t need a huge blowware ‘do-it-all-app’. (reminds me of Corel, It also tried to do everything).
David and Mordy,
your discussions keep me interested in what I am doing .When ever I feel lost and alone in the land of adobe , I just go to a blog ,and there are mordy and david going at it.I love that there is such a place to discuss issues with peers or percieved peers like you guys .
**Keep up the great work **
what will be new win miami ?
I attended the chicago Creative suite conference last year, it was great but I have to convience the CFO it’s worth going again…
I hate to break the news to you but .ai files have been pdf’s since illustrator 10. Just open one up in a text editor. You will see the glorious %PDF-1.4 right at the top of the page. If you go back further, say to illustrator 8 you will get the old familiar%!PS-Adobe-3.0
%%Creator: Adobe Illustrator(R) 8.0. I believe when you try and place one of these old style .ai files you will get a wonderful preview like always.
Now I am not saying anything but the fact that Adobe got rid of .ai file along time ago. It would still be nice to be able to “touch it up” in InDesign……
This is the way it might work one day: The document would be cross-application. When choosing a photograph – the appropriate set of tools (now familiar to us from photoshop) would show. When choosing an illustration – illustrator’s-like set of tools show, etc. Working on each object would not be involved with leaving the document.
So… nobody’s loves icc-profiles? (Am I the only one using color-profiles?)
Yes — David and I share a passion for excellence in our field. We are great friends and have these kinds of discussions all the time. As long as David gives me the illusion that I’m right all the time, I’m ok with that… ;)
Now excuse me while I go make my case for adding a timeline to InDesign — I hate having to go into AfterEffects to do my animations…
Thanks, Woz. And for anyone who wonders, Mordy and I are sworn enemies… no, wait, I mean great friends. We argue like this in real life, too. Can’t help it; it’s in our blood.
Mordy, you and I will just have to do battle over these issues another day. I must go back to my bat cave to renew my energy and prepare for another night of crimefighting in Gotham. Tune in next week at the same Bat Channel for The New Gripe: Why Can’t I Use Targa Files For All My Work?
(Kidding! I’m just kidding!)
Before I forget: I really liked this discussion. Not every story has to be ‘polished’ and ‘clean’ without emotion. Talks like these look exactly like the ones we users have over here. Even though I am in Amsterdam (EU) it sort of makes me feel more connected with you guys over there. The world is a village indeed. So thanks for sharing. (I would like to read more about how you feel about other CS-‘funnies’).
What a nice read! While your at it: how about letting me choose a ICC profile when I create a new document? I would like Indi and Illu to be able to do that just like Photoshop. (It’s madness to have to change the preferences every time).
I must not be communicating well. I’m not saying everything is hunky dory and that Adobe’s work is done. Far from it — there’s plenty of room for improvement. I do my best — as you do David — to get Adobe to see what us and other users need.
My argument was that while you seem to want to import true native AI data, I disagree and believe that the way InDesign reads a PDF embedded in an AI file works.
Does Edit Original need to be better? Of course it does! Does AI need to write better options into that embedded PDF? You bet it does. Currently you can specify bleed (as JC pointed out), and you can’t get layers either. Heck, you can’t even specify a PDF hyperlink in Illustrator (which is insane! — ID has been able to do that for ages now).
So yes, there’s plenty of stuff that has to be fixed and addressed. But making ID understand native AI constructs isn’t one of them.
Oh, and by the way, Smart Objects aren’t vector in Photoshop itself — let alone when you save that PSD to be used elsewhere. A smart object doesn’t mean “vector”. A smart object is still pixels (and smart objects aren’t limited to Illustrator files as you know — Photoshop content can also be a smart obejct — as can Raw files, and other things).
Very funny, Josh. ;) Of course, there’s already a plug-in to control iTunes from within InDesign, so why not control everything else. InDesign as the central repository of all human knowledge! Bwah-ha-ha-ha-ha… (cough cough hack)
A-hem. Back to the subject at hand. Mordy, you know more about the internal workings of these programs than any of us. But I continue to be idealistic about it: It’s a suite. I want to import native files without thinking about it. I want to convert one file type into another. There is nothing wrong with wanting this, especially because Adobe has been pushing this vision for years.
But even as you argue for what we do have, you inadvertently refer to problems in the workflow. For example, you mention Smart Objects. But Photoshop’s vector smart objects cannot be exported as vectors — they’re always rasterized! I’m sorry, but that’s insane. If I place a vector PDF in a Photoshop file and then export a PDF from Photoshop, it should retain the vectors, but Adobe hasn’t delivered that. Add that one to my list.
Edit Original is wonderful, but it’s braindead: It only asks the OS to open the file without any intelligence. A smart “edit original” would actually look at the file and know that a PDF saved from Photoshop on the Mac should be opened in Photoshop, not Preview or Acrobat. The least Adobe needs is an “Edit Original in…” feature.
Look, as I said at the start: I love the Suite. It’s powerful and wonderful, but you’re not going to be able to convince me to stop wishing it were better. It should be better, and it will get better in time… if enough people complain about its shortcomings.
(Every Adobe person I know says the same thing: When enough people tell us they want change, we change.)
David, I’ve tried importing/opening an AI document in InDesign with the only PDF option checked that I could find, and it came in with text outlined.
It looks to me like Adobe has not only NOT fixed the problem, but made it worse. That can’t be!
What’s the status of this issue, using the CC versions of AI and InD?
Thanks, Terre
Terre: I’m not sure what you’re doing. InDesign cannot currently open AI files (unless you have a 3rd party commercial plugin such as PDF2ID). It can only place them (using File > Place), where they appear as non-editable static images. So I’m not sure what you mean by the text being outlined. It might be better to follow up on this in the Forums, not in the comments of this old article.
As for CC… nothing has really changed in 10+ years on this topic.
Oh, and one more thing — you really can’t compare Photoshop to Illustrator in this case. Yes, ID supports Adjustment layers and layer content from PS — but that’s simply because it’s all pixels. The imaging model for pixels is very different of that from an object-based app like AI.
And remember that ID still can’t understand Photoshop’s blend modes, but AI files don’t have that problem. So there’s give and take at many levels.
Oh — and one more thing to add to your list. I’d like ID to share the same pathfinder/compound shape funcitonality — which is also consistent with Photoshop’s vector shape layers.
And most of all, I’d LOVE to see both ID and PS be able to share Symbols with AI and Flash.
Think about it — expanding apperances would mean that pixel-based effects would become rasterized, and thereby no longer scalable. And editability would be severely compromised.
Here’s the way I look at the entire picture — if you want to edit something in InDesign, then create it in InDesign. To me, if you really need Illustrator content on that kind of level, then you should be using Illustrator to create it.
David, you speak of Adobe’s creation of a Suite “bed” which Adobe must now sleep in. Well, Adobe *is* sleeping in it — by building on the strengths of each application. You have a way to move content between apps in a very intelligent way. That allows you to create content in any suite app and use that content in other suite apps. The Edit Original and Smart Object features mean it’s possible to quickly edit that content within the app that created it.
I agree with Fred on his comment about the usefulness of what you propose. Right now I can create awesome content in PS, AI, and ID, and I can freely place that content into any of those apps as well. And editing any of that content is never more than a double-click away.
InDesign is primarily an aggregate application — and if I have a way to place any kind of content, and be able to edit that content quickly in its own native environment, that’s all that I need.
I’d really like it if InDesign could connect with my bank and pay my bills. If you think about it, all Adobe has to do is embed a web browser subsystem into the program and then let me use a palette to choose when to pay my bills. When will Adobe listen to it’s users? :-)
I certainly wouldn’t call opening an editable AI doc in ID crazy. For all the effects, it could basically “expand appearance”, blends could, too.
Although, it would be debatable how useful something like that would be. Imagine trying to work with an expanded pattern brush or blend it ID.
Mordy, Mordy, Mordy… Come on now. What happens when you import a PSD without Maximize Compatibility turned on? InDesign still imports it, but it alerts the user: “This image was saved in Photoshop without maximum file compatibility. To speed up performance, save the image from Photoshop with the maximum compatibility preference enabled, and then import it. Do you want to place this image anyway?” It then offers a “Don’t show again” checkbox (thank you Adobe!).
This is the way it should work with AI files. If you click OK, InDesign is still able to read the PSD — including layers, adjustment layers, type layers, layer modes, and so on. In other words, InDesign must understand the PSD file format, even without the composite. If ID can work with the Photoshop team, them it can certainly work with the AI team!
I can’t wait for the Miami smackdown. ;)
As for making AI files editable: You’re right, Fred, I wasn’t talking about making them editable, but now that you mention it, please add that to my list: There is no reason why I shouldn’t be able to simply convert a placed AI or PDF file into InDesign vectors, especially easy stuff. If some of it cannot be faithfully reproduced, then ID can easily alert me that some of it didn’t translate. I can deal with that.
Fred, no one said anything about editing AI content in ID. In order to DISPLAY it, you’d need to support those constructs natively in InDesign. So instead, Adobe gives you exactly what you’re asking for — a way to place a composite version of your AI file. Instead of the expensive way of having ID support all of AI’s constructs, there’s a better way. Since ID can understand PDF already, AI gives you a PDF.
Yes, Adobe “hides” this PDF inside the AI file. But it works. And it works very well.
nTo me, it sounds like David is just upset that Adobe is hyping up how you can place native .ai files when really it’s doing it with a bit of trickery up its sleeve. Although technically, the file IS a native Illustrator document (it’s a .ai file), but ID just chooses to read the PDF portion of the file instead of the native portion of it.
What do you want Adobe to say? That InDesign can place PDF files that have been embedded within native Illustrator files?
I side with Fred when he says “I couldn’t care less” — as long as it works :)
I must still be high from the smoke when I burned my Quark install disk, I better get sober so I can start bitching about Indesign minutiae.
Mordy,
I think you’re misunderstanding Dave, he’s not looking for an editable AI file in InDesign. Rather, just as you can place an PDF, he would like to place an AI file.
Personally, I couldn’t care less. It seems like Dave said, it’s only an issue with regards to downloading a file from the web or emailing.
Having said that, it makes sense that InDesign should be able to import an AI file (not editable).
The “our” was a collective one :)
The Photoshop team does NOT have to deal with the same thing with PSD files. There are great differences between the imaging models of both AI and PS. And more to the point, a PSD file is made of pixels. It isn’t like AI files that also have a wide range of different constructs. Think about it — if you really wanted ID to read true native AI content, you’d need to have full support for appearances in ID. You’d need to support envelopes. Live Paint. Live Trace. Gradient Mesh. The list goes on forever.
By embedding a PDF into the native AI file, you’re allowing ID to access a composite of the entire AI file — while keeping transparency and the like all intact.
In reality, when you save a layerd file out of Photoshop, you get a dialog asking if you want Maximum Compatibility turned on. Ever wonder what that might be? It’s a composite — much like what the PDF does for AI.
If you really are so interested in accessing all of this Illustrator content, maybe you should consider using Illustrator instead of InDesign?
;) Mordy
Mordy, you’re showing your history again when you say things like “our legal dept. at Adobe.” ;)
I don’t buy your argument about stagnating AI’s growth. After all, the Photoshop team has to deal with the same thing with PSD files, no? It’s a Suite, not a bunch of point programs. Adobe made its “suite” bed, now it has to sleep in it.
As Woz pointed out, it’s easy to create JPEG 2000 files. Perhaps they released this as a separately-installable plug-in for Photoshop because of the potential patent issues (which are mostly resolved anyway). Adobe could do the same thing for InDesign.
quote “I was a Freehand man, myself. I loved Freehand dearly in the early ?90s”
RIP Freehand..
though a illustrator convert for a couple of years now, i still open freehand up when i want to get basic logo ideas realised quickly. give me paste inside and freehands select/tranform techniques any day of the week.
Dudes, the is a JPEG2000 import for Photoshop on the original Adobe CS CD.
But I agree, Indi should also be ablo to import JPEG2000. I once saw my RGB work flow go down the tubes because the digital photographer ‘bozo’ chose JPEG2000. I’m sure he just chose that to screw up my RGB/Indi/PDF workflow. (It got me all his DTP-work, because I could work 3 to 4 times as fast as him using Xpress 5!)
As for your bullet points:
– You CAN turn on and off layers from an AI file. But you have to do it the other way around: Save your file from Illustrator as a PDF 1.6 file and check the option to convert layers to Acrobat layers. Check the Preserve AI editing option to make the file also editable in AI. You’ll then be able to turn layers on and off using Object Layer Options in ID.
My latest podcast episode covered why text can be copied freely between AI and PS, but not ID. But it would be nice to see that capability added.
As for the JPEG2000 support, not really sure what you’re asking for. Not even Photoshop can create a JPEG2000 file (in fact, JPEG2000 is really more of a capture format, used in digital cameras, etc). But if you read up on it, there are extensive legal roadblocks with JPEG2000 — and we all know how much we love our legal department at Adobe :)
Oh man, it’s a Mordy and David Smackdown! Maybe we should take this up on stage at the upcoming Creative Suite Conference in Miami, eh? ;)
Seriously though, what you propose isn’t healthy (in my opinion anyway). If the Adobe Illustrator team needed to publish their internal format so that others would be able to parse it, that would stagnate their growth. It would mean that each time they wanted to add a new feature to AI, they would need to make sure it was OK with the ID team as well. But this is only part of the problem.
Can you even begin to imagine the performance drain on redraw or processing in ID if you were busy parsing all of that 3D data, gradient mesh info, complex appearances, warp effects, symbols, etc.? I mean, you need that kind of info in ID anyway.
Where I do agree with you is how you are upset that Adobe pours you a tall cool glass of kool aid when they tell you that you can place a native AI file into InDesign. Well, it’s true, kinda — that the file is a native file — it just also contains a PDF in it.
I’m SO with Josh about file size. Who cares how large the file is? As long as I get what I need. I’m not advocating gas guzzling SUV files — but I’ll gladly accept a file that is larger if it means I can edit it more easily.
Josh, storage isn’t the main problem people have: It’s data transfer across networks and across the Web. I don’t care if it’s a single 10 MB file vs. a 5 MB file… but when I have to deal with 100 or 1000 of these, well, people get testy.
Your fifth bullet at the bottom is something I want to see more than anything else. I can’t stand it that the text engines from Photoshop, Illustrator and InDesign don’t interact properly with each other and you end up getting chopped up sentences and words. Truly frustrating.
Regarding the main point of the article, however, I have to say, personally, that while I agree that AI should be natively imported regardless of the PDF compatibility being on, I don’t so much mind the extra size of the file. In a day of terrabyte hard drives and USB memory sticks the size of my thumb that can store 4gb, the added size that a PDF compatible AI file brings is not a concern for me. The fact that I can see a crisply rendered AI file in InDesign is the important point — and that I can easily roundtrip the file with Illustrator to make changes.
My main complain about the native format of Illustrator when imported in Indesign is that their is no way to place it and set a bleed value either on import or inside illustrator itself. A real pain… it is to reopen it and enlarge the artboard to allow bleed area.
I’d also like to see SVG Import. Maybe by the time Mars is out of beta?
It’s almost like Adobe wants to get rid of .AI files all together. Illustrator is the grand-daddy of Adobe apps and they need to respect their elders better!